? about switching guns....

[pandemonia]

As my previous post stated I just bought the HK USP .40 compact. This is the second handgun that I have bought. My first was the Springfield xd-9 tactical. And I have to say I actualy like the springfield more primarily because I can shoot it 2x better than I can the HK. Granted the xd-9 has a 5' barrel and the USP has a 3.58'. I guess my question is do you have to make adjustments or relearn to use a new gun after you are used to a certain gun alread?y? I have to admit im pretty pissed off that I spent $689 on the USP and my best score was 71 from 15 yds. My average was probably in the low 60's to high 50's. However ever when I shot my xd-9 I scored in the 80's (im not saying that this is a good score im just saying that i shoot a lot better with the xd-9). I realize that I have put a few thousand rounds through my xd-9 and i've only shot the HK 200 times but I guess I don't understand why I did so horrible with my USP. Do you think after time I will become better with it or do u think that the USP isn't the gun for me and maybe I shoot better with the springfield's? I hope that I will become much better with it because I could have saved myself a $300 hundred bucks by buying another springfield lol.

[5ontarget]

I'm pretty confident that you'll get better with it as you practice with your new gun. There are so many different types of guns out there, you're bound to shoot one better than the others. Some of us pick up a Glock and shoot it very well, others have a hard time hitting a wall from the inside of a building with one.
You have a couple of good guns, it seems that the H&K will take more effort for you to shoot well.

I don't own many guns, but I shoot the xd best, and had the shortest learning curve/adjustment period of the few I own.

When I switch guns at the range, it will often take a magazine or so when I switch guns.

["DoubleAction"]

I agree with 5ontarget; It takes some people time to acclimate themselves to a new handgun after spending much of their time with something else. I once stayed with nothing but the 1911s for well over a year and one day I picked up one of my favorite Sigs in the same .45 acp to find I was not shooting it as well as I should have been. Since then, I always make the habit of carrying a Sig with me for every shooting session, no matter what else I carry.

[TMan]

Okay, let me give you my two cents, since I shoot a lot of different guns:

I seriously doubt if the problem is the length of the barrel at 15 yards. I also doubt if it is the intrinsic accuracy of the H&K because they are well known to be accurate guns.

So, if it isn't the gun... Personally, I've always shot well with the XD-9, and I don't understand why. The trigger is nothing to rave about, and I have night sights, which during daylight don't make the front sight the easiest to focus on.

I don't know how old you are, but for those of us getting on in years, the distance from the front sight to the eyeball can make a difference i.e. it can be harder to focus on the front sight than with other guns. This problem will manifest itself by hits that are all over the target.

You didn't say where the shots were that missed the point of aim. If they were low, or low to the left (assuming you are right-handed), you are either jerking the trigger or flinching.

I nearly always flinch if I'm shooting a new gun, or a gun that I've worked on. The caliber doesn't matter, I've done it on .22's as much as .357 magnum. I've found that it helps me to first shoot a gun I trust that has a higher caliber first. Then when I shoot the new gun, I'm telling myself that this is a piece of cake.

The other thing I've found that helps is to wear the foam earplugs underneath my normal headset style. That reduces the noise, and makes me more comfortable.

The .40 S&W round does have more muzzle energy than the 9mm, which translates to more recoil and noise - either of which could be effecting you, and making you nervous. If you are too tense, your muscles will get to tight, and you get too twitchy, which again will manifest itself as you being all over the target.

My H&K is the "Elite" model and is breaking at 3.75lbs vs. 6.75lbs on my XD-9. Normally, a trigger pull of 6.75lbs would cause me to shoot low. However, on the XD-9 it doesn't for some reason. Like I've mentioned on this forum many times before, I liked my instructor's XD-9 so much I borrowed it to take my CHL test.

Flinching is something that has always plagued me, but someone on this forum told me to hold the gun lightly with my right hand so it was relaxed, and then grip the fairly tightly, but not tight enough to cause shaking, with the left hand.

I hate to admit this factor because it is so embrassing. I get quite upset with myself when I do it. How many rounds are you loading into the magazine? Don't go over 5 unless you are sure you are not doing this: when I'm shooting something new, I forget to breath. I end up holding my breath until all the rounds in the magazine are shot. Lack of oxygen to the muscles causes them to twitch and there goes accuracy. I discovered this shooting 10 round magazines out of the S&W 41, (.22LR), which is probably one of the most accurate guns I own.

Finally, and I don't think this is can be fixed because you can't change the grips: how well does the H&K fit your hand? If the XD-9 is a much better fit, that could explain the problem. The H&K is a little uncomfortable in my hand, and the XD-9 is a great fit. I found with my little Kimber, which hurt my hand to shoot, I have an incredible increase in accuracy be wearing an "Uncle Mike's Shooting Glove".

Don't give up on the H&K just yet. I've seen some federal agents, that have to be accurate, shoot some incredible scores with the H&K's chambered in .40 S&W.

[pandemonia]

Thx for your guys input I appreciate it. In response to Tman. Im still a younger guy, im 22, and I have 20/20. And I don't think that I hold my breath. Generaly I take a shot then I breathe and I hold my breath in an inhale or an exhale when I go to pull the trigger but after the shot is taken I start to breathe again. (I don't know if this is correct this is just how I shoot rifles and its now carried over to shooting pistols..Im new with pistols) Another thing I noticed when I shot is that the trigger pull seemed to be easier on my springfield than on my HK...I know that the pounds to pull the trigger is less (im not sure of the lbs. to pull on the HK but i know its less). Im guessing that it seems this way because Im used to shooting the springfield and the HK is foreign to me. The HK also fits my hand quit well its a little fatter of a grip than the xd9 but I like the feel especially with the little finger extender grip on the mag my pinky feels quit comfortable sitting on that. My misses are generaly different with the xd9 and the USP. My misses with the xd9 are usually to the left (I rarely miss right, high, or low) and my misses with the USP were mostly to the left also but I believe a lot of misses were sparatic. Although I did find myself tagging more bullseyes with the HK than I did with my xd9 which is kind of wierd. I can just keep a lot tighter group with the xd9 than I can with the HK. I know my accuracy is an issue with me and not the weapon. Sometimes I would catch myself slightly flintching and kind of jumping on the trigger in anticipation of recoil. I hate it when I do that. A friend of my fathers, an ex cop, gave me some advice that you all might be interested in also. He told me to randomly load blanks with some hotter loads in my magazine. He said that this will help me break the habbit of flinching because you will catch yourself flinching and jerking the gun when you shoot the blanks. Thanks again for your advice/input.

["DoubleAction"]

pandemonia said:

A friend of my fathers, an ex cop, gave me some advice that you all might be interested in also. He told me to randomly load blanks with some hotter loads in my magazine. He said that this will help me break the habbit of flinching because you will catch yourself flinching and jerking the gun when you shoot the blanks. Thanks again for your advice/input.

Loading Dummy Cartridges, or short loading magazines, is a training method which has the gun motionless after the trigger is activated. Any flinching that occures will replicate the same reflex as one would have with a live cartridge. Pulling shots is almost like flinching, but not quite as bad because with flinching the shooter will often blink the eyes at the time of the shot. Practice is all in getting these things worked out; Seeing the muzzle flash is a sign your working on your flinching. Stiff, gritty, or longer heavier trigger strokes, will also result in the shooter to sometimes pull the muzzle slightly down at the time of the shot. CO2 pellet pistols, gas operated soft air pistols, or 22 rimfires are also good practical training aids .

[TMan]

I've tried the snap-caps interspersed with the live rounds, and what that does is confirm that you are flinching. It doesn't really correct it - it just ticked me off all the more because it proved what I already suspected.

It sounds to me like your problem is tightening the fingers of your right hand in anticipation of the round going off. Try keeping your right hand loose, but squeeze fairly tightly with the left hand.

It is kind of funny (I know - I'm sick) when you see someone else, that is normally a better shot than you are, flinch. I have a Walther P22 that has a heavy trigger (it is .22LR). I've watched my buddy shoot it, and I've seen the front of the barrel take a little dip, and the gun didn't go off. Of course it isn't at all funny when I do it. ;D

[psustang89]

I don't have a whole lot of handgun experience, but I do own the HK USP .40, so I'll say a few words. I feel your pain and frustration with this gun, but it will get better. I found that I was dipping the barrel and usually shooting low left. After some .22 therapy and many a clip through the HK, I have more or less corrected the problem. It does come back every once in a while, usually after switching guns like you said. I just have to consciously not dip the barrel.

A friend of mine is a handgun wizzard and pointed out my HK problem. He also tutored me on my .44 by loading only 3 rounds randomly in my gun and handing it to me. The result of hitting an empty cylinder wasn't pretty and quite embarrassing. The real kicker was I new it was coming! The advice he gave me was shoot a .22 and shoot it often. Then continously move up the ranks until you're shooting the .44 like the .22 (if that's possible). You see, my eyes were bigger than my brain when I bought the Super Redhawk .44. That's why my next purchase will be a .357 (kind of backwards). Anyway, that advice has worked for me so far. Good luck with the HK! Just give it time and practice.