My first handgun, decision decisions

[jcchance]

So, I learned the basics of shooting on a 1911-A1 while in the Navy. Now that I have been out for a few years I find myself wanting to get a handgun for personal use and concealed carry. I live near Detroit and unfortunately there are some places that I just don't feel comfortable around here.

At first I wanted nothing more than a 1911 again, but then I started looking at a few others. I definitely want a .45, I just love the stopping power. I'm 6 foot 2 inches so a full size automatic is still a possibility as a concealed carry piece. Aside from the caliber I would like Pictanny Rails or at least compatible with a light/laser. Accurate and reliable...duh...does anyone honestly want an UN-reliable gun? Cost is a definite factor, I can't really go much past 600.00 for the pistol itself and some very basic accessories (cleaning kit magazines etc)

So far my short list is as follows.

Taurus PT 24/7 (NRA Handgun of the Year 2005)
Ruger KP345PR (Guns & Ammo Gun of the Year 2004)
Springfield Armory XD 45Gap (Would prefer ACP, but would settle for Gap)

Anybody have any major likes/dislikes about these three? Any others I should add to my list?

My final decision will not be made until I can get my greedy hands around the grips of any of these pistols and see how they feel, but I hope to have as much info as possible before I even set foot in the gun shop.

Thanks in advance.
Chance

[MLB]

Welcome Chance. Let's see...

.45, 1911, and $600 sounds like a Springfield Armory Mil-Spec. I don't believe it has the rails you're looking for though.

I've only heard good things about the XD handguns. I'm not all that confident that the .45GAP will stick around that long though.

[TMan]

Chance, I'm a firm believer in Taurus revolvers, but personally I wouldn't buy a 24/7. I've heard some bad things about their semi-autos, but they may have had those fixed by now. Of course they do have a lifetime warranty. However, repeatedly sending a gun back to the manufacturer could get old (and expensive).

Unfortunately, Ruger had some startup problems with the 345, and it got a bad rap. Not quite as bad as the New Vaquero that got recalled by the factory.

I don't put a whole lot of faith in the reports in gun magazines other than Gun Tests you never read anything negative.

This brings us to the Springfield XD, which would be my pick of your short list. I have an XD in 9x19, which I bought after borrowing one from my instructor to get my CHL. I shot mine last week, and was amazed at how well I shot with it. I shot my H&K P7 again today and was totally ticked off. It isn't the gun, it is me, and I know it. I think from a bench-rest I would shoot the P7 better than the XD, but what matters in a defensive pistol is how well you shoot it off-hand vs. the intrinsic accuracy of the pistol.

It would be nice if there was a range somewhere near you where you could rent the guns you are interested in and see what you are most comfortable with holding and shooting.

Unlike MLB, I think the .45 GAP will be around for a long time because so many manufacturers are jumping on the bandwagon and making pistols for that caliber.

Good luck, and welcome to this forum.

[jcchance]

MLB and TMan, thanks for the info...

Of course I could just go back to the old faithful 1911, but then comes the question of WHICH 1911...oh boy what a headache. Ask 50 different owners and you will get 50 different opinions. I like the Springfield, its what I carried in the Navy and I already know how durable and solid the thing is, and I know that I can hit the broadside of a barn with one.

However, I'm looking for something a bit more than just solid and durable. I want a few of the refinements like the lighter weight polymers and light/laser combos. So, keeping that in mind, the XD sounds like my best bet overall. I've gotten the same or similar comments about these brands from a few others. As for the longevity of the Gap, if worst comes to worst, it fades away and I have an excuse to get a new gun. ;D

There is a range with rentals nearby. I'll probably stop by within the next week or so to see what makes and models they have.

TMan, Where can I find these Gun Tests you mention? Are they on-line anywhere?

[TMan]

Gun Tests is actually a monthly publication. They have a web-site at: www.gun-tests.com/

Should you decide to get a 1911, I think Springfield Armory would be a good choice. I have one somewhere, but it is the military style one. When I shot one in the service my eye-sight was better than it is now. I have a hard time picking up the front sight. I think the Springfields are a good buy. My dealer has one model for $409 the PW9108L, which retails for $502.

There are some real 1911 fans on this forum, I have some 1911's that I like and some are just okay. I shoot the best with my Kimber Gold Match, but my Wilson Combat Compact comes a close second. The reason so many like the 1911 is that there are so many different parts that can be upgraded from a lot of manufacturers.

I've sort of temporarily lost interest in handguns. I've gotten into Mil-Surp rifles. However, after working on my next door neighbors new laptop most of the day, I retreated to home and put a Volquartsen kit into my Ruger Mark III along with a new main spring. I can't wait to try it at the range Monday.

["DoubleAction"]

A first handgun is usually based on a specific purpose for which it will be used; In your case it is for concealed carry. Size, Weight, and Caliber play a large part of making such a choice in a carry piece.
You mentioned a preference for the .45 ACP, with a $600. price tag, you also mentioned having became familiar with the 1911.
For carry purposes I prefer the Tritium Night Sights, over the laser devices.
A steel frame 1911 will have a little more weight for carry but it provides an easy option of upgrading the the components as time passes.
Before deciding on the .45 GAP cartridge, over that of the .45 ACP, I would first compare the cost of ammunition.
Whatever you decided to buy, know that the pistol will deliver the kind of accuracy, speed, reliability, comfort of carry, and stopping power you require in order to participate in an armed confrontation of a life threatening nature.
I'm not usually very good on giving advice for first time buyers on a budget, however, I have purchased many very nice handguns for well under $600., with my primary carry piece having only cost me $500.
I carry a Sig 239 in the .40 S&W chambering, with an optional 357 sig barrel conversion, and Trijicon Tritium Night Sights. The stock grips on the pistol did not fit with my hand as I liked so I purchased a set of Hogue Wrap arounds for $20. to cure that minor problem. I purchased this pistol as a pre-owned, which had only been fired once, this saved me some money.
Becoming familiar with certain models will offer a great deal of savings when purchasing a pre-owned handgun. Many people seldom shoot a handgun before trading it in for another, or selling it. One particular $600. purchase I made was a New In Box, never Fired, pre-owned full satin nickeled Sig 229 in .40 S&W, with Trijicon Tritium Night Sights. I knew the owner who had just sold it to a local dealer before ever firing it for the first time.
I can go on about purchases I made for under $500. - $600. range, for new pre-owns; Some of my best pieces fit in this catagory. I also buy new, but that's when I just have to acquire a certain piece without a patient search.
I usually have a very long list of those guns I would want, hoping to find one sitting in a used counter or offered up by a friend.

[5ontarget]

My current line of thinking is the GAP will not be a fad cartridge. It is too easy for gun manufacturers to convert a mid sized frame for .40, 9mm, 357sig to fire the GAP. I think this was one of the driving forces in developing the cartridge. With time, the price of the ammo should drop as more manufacturers get on board. In the meantime, you'll just have to bite the bullet (sorry for the bad pun, but I couldn't resist).

I own an XD in 357sig, and have shot the .40. A 9mm conversion bbl is on Santa's list this year. I like them very well. I've never had any problems with mine, except once when I shot some not so cheap, but apparently poorly made reloads through it. NEVER a single missfire, FTF, FTE using new ammo.


Of your choices listed, I would buy the XD. I don't know is Sigs appeal to you, but you might be able to find a used 220 with a tac rail in your price range.

[TA]

You really do have many choices. Renting is a good way to find out what you like.

The XD is a great choice. You should be able to find one for under $450 new. If you go with .40 S&W, you will avoid the higher cost 357 Sig or .45 GAP ammo.

SigArms would also serve you very well. You can get a railed P229 or P220, but the P229 is not available in .45. You can get P239's and non-railed P229's, P220's within your price range.

Springfield's 1911's are really good for the money. You can buy a Mil-Spec for around $500 new or a WWII for ~ $425 new. Ifyou want to spend a few more dollars, I would recommend the S&W 1911's. They do have the external extractor, but it works well and the fit and finish seems a little better that SA's to me. I have a Scandium framed Commander (1911Sc) that is really nice to carry. It is very light but still handles the .45 round very well. They run $700-750 new, so you might be able to find a used one in your price range.