Kel-Tec PF-9

[5ontarget]

Well the rumors seem to be true. Coming in May 2006, Kel-Tec will offer a single stack 9mm. Advertised as the lightest and flattest 9mm made. It is sized between the 3AT for and the p-11 for thickness, and shares most of the other dimensions with the p-11.

www.kel-tec.com/pf9pr.htm


Caliber: 9mm Luger
Weight unloaded (no magazine): 12.7 oz
Length: 5.85"
Height: 4.3"
Width: .88""
Barrel length 3.1"
Capacity: 7+1


compare to the P-11 (double stack)
Calibers: 9 x 19 mm
Weight unloaded lbs. 14 oz.
Loaded magazine 6oz. Length 5.6"
Height 4.3"
Width 1"
Barrel Length 3.1"
Capacity 10+1 rounds

(I don't know why the single stack is longer than the double stack. Same barrel length for the 2 guns. I'd think they'd try to make it smaller. Makes me wonder if the length measurements are accurate. )

and the stats for the 3AT:

Caliber: .380 AUTO
Weight unloaded: 8.3 oz
Loaded magazine:2.8 oz
Length:5.2"
Height:3.5"
Width:.77"
Capacity:6+1 rounds


retail prices:
PF-9 Pistol, Blued $314.00
PF-9 Pistol, Parkerized $355.00
PF-9 Pistol, Hard Chrome $368.00

[ron]

It looks good, but it's weight is 50% more than my KelTec P3AT, and almost the weight of the 15 oz S&W 642. It's certainly thinner than the 642.

The overall thickness is larger than the Rorbaugh 9 slide thickness, but it is narrower than the Rorbaugh overall.

The Rorbaugh is 3x the price, though.

Ron

[Callahan]

Hey, 5ontarget, thank for posting all that! I have my 3AT in my back pocket as I type this.

I heard rumors of this pistol a month or so ago. I can hardly wait to examine one. Friend of mine say it is very slightly lighter than his Kahr PM9 and about half the price.

And one-third the price of the Rohrbaugh is even better!

I think the length must be a typo, too. That just doesn't seem right with a what? 3-inch barrel?

[TBT]

Whats the deal with Keltec? Are they of decent quality?

[Callahan]

tbt said:

Whats the deal with Keltec? Are they of decent quality?

TBT:
Yeah, they are. Here's a few paragraphs from the 3AT owner's manual to give you an idea with some comments later on from me:

From the very beginning of the design and development, computers have been used
exclusively. All machined components are also made on modern high speed
computerized equipment. Equally advanced quality control equipment and test
procedures ensure a firearm with uncompromising quality in materials and workmanship.
CONSTRUCTION
The P-3AT has six main component groups: barrel, slide, frame, firing mechanism, grip,
and magazine.
The barrel is made of SAE 4140 ordnance steel, heat treated to 48 HRC.
The slide is also 4140 steel, and contains the firing pin and the extractor.
The rectangular frame is machined from a solid 7075-T6 aluminum extrusion and
houses the firing mechanism.
The trigger connects via a transfer bar to the hammer. The hammer is driven by a
novel free floating extension spring. The light weight firing pin transmits the energy
of the hammer to ignite the primer. After firing, the hammer block holds the hammer
away from the firing pin, providing a mechanical safety. The functioning of the
mechanism greatly surpasses all applicable SAAMI safety standards.
The grip is made of the ultra high impact polymer Dupont ST-8018. The grip also
forms the magazine well and the trigger guard.

Added to that, all Kel-Tecs have a lifetime warranty that applies to the original owner and they have a reputation for having perhaps the best customer service of any pistol maker in the U.S.

Here are the only problems that I know of with Kel-Tec pistols:

P40 -- no longer in production. It was too light a pistol for the .40 S&W cartridge. Recoil was too much for many shooters.

P11 -- no major probles with their first 9mm. it is still in production. Many see it as a low-cost option to the Kahr.

p32 -- smallest and lightest .32ACP. Still in production, it's a nice pistol and the only problem here is the fault of the .32-caliber cartridge. In magazines, it's possible for the rims to overlap and lock together, limiting the user to FMJ cartridges in order to avoid the rimlock problem.

3AT -- this pistol was starting to get a bad rep becuse it was put on the market with an extractor that was not stout enough and a lot of buyers got frustrated with them. Kel-Tec fixed them free of charge and has for the past few months been distributing the "second generation" 3AT with a stronger extractor. Mine is faultless through the first few hundred rounds.

Hope that helps.

[5ontarget]

I have the 1st generation 3AT, and I had some initial problems with it. Like Callahan mentioned, I got a new extractor (no questions asked, no charge, and I had it in 2 days from my phone call), changed my grip slightly, and shot it more. I still get "smilies" on the top round in the magazine from the feed ramp hitting it, but I will fix that with a little filing. I think this problem too is resolved in the 2nd generation. I just shot 50rds with it again recently, no problems, except a sore finger. I did not do the "fluff n buff" on the gun, I just broke it in by shooting it more. I've got to be nearing 1000rds through it by now. It seems by many reports that the 2nd generation is very reliable out of the box. I think many people also tend to limpwrist this gun. It is light, has narrow/thin and short grips, it lends itself (unfortunately) to limpwristing. I don't think this will be a problem with the 9mm, as the grip is longer. A pinky extension on the magazines really helps with the 3AT (they are also available in +1 extension so you can carry 8rds total).

I really like my 3AT, it serves its purpose well, a small reliable concealable handgun. The trigger pull is smooth and light for a DAO pistol. I can put it in my front pocket behind a money clip, or in a wallet holster and it doesn't print at all. I will say my 3AT feels cheap, and toy-like. I think it is because it is plastic and light. Definitely not like the feel and heft of a metal framed gun. Then again, that is largely why I got it, because it was so small and light. The grips on the PF-9 look more comfortable than my "checkered" plastic, I found it to be a little too aggressive for my liking.

I don't regret spending $200 on this little gun at all. I think KT makes some of the best concealable guns for the money. Yes, there are other makers out there, and they cost more, and may look a little better. But I don't think they will be more reliable, and hey, the gun spends most of the time doing its job, staying concealed. If no one sees it, who cares what it looks like! I didn't address accuracy, because I don't think any gun this small, made for concealment, is designed for tight groups. If I can hit a head and/or chest size target at 7yds, that is good enough for me for this type of gun. If I take my time, I can usually get groups the size of an index card or better. The main factors for my decision on getting the 3AT included price, concealability, and power. At the time of my purchase, the 3AT was the best blend of these, combined with reliablility (after a little work)



Did you guys notice the little tac rail on the pf-9?

[ron]

The first time I fired the P3AT, I had FTF, FTE, stovepipes, and all the other acronyms.
Then, I read about limp-wristing.
On my next trip to the range, being careful not to limp-wrist, it was perfect and has been ever since.

Ron

[Callahan]

I'm surprised by that, Ron, because you look like you're a pretty good-sized guy. I would have thought limp-wristing would be more a problem in folks who are light and small-framed, but obviously that's not the case.

Come to think of it. I got a pistol from a friend who had stovepipes with it, and he is over 6 feet and about 260. I've never had a problem with it.

I used to let pistols roll up when I fired. I guess a habit from watching cowboys on old TV shows firing revolvers. Semi-autos sure put an end to me doing that!

[ron]

The limp-wristing was just a symptom of laziness. The gun was so light, I loosened up on my grip and the rigidity with which I hold my wrists.

I may have been carrying a pink purse that day, and acted accordingly. ;D

Ron

[Callahan]

Hey, I've seen yer pic. If you did happen to be carrying a pink purse, and I ran into you, I'm sure I would not make any smart-a$$ comments!

[Callahan]

5ontarget said:

I don't regret spending $200 on this little gun at all. I think KT makes some of the best concealable guns for the money. Yes, there are other makers out there, and they cost more, and may look a little better. But I don't think they will be more reliable, and hey, the gun spends most of the time doing its job, staying concealed. If no one sees it, who cares what it looks like! I didn't address accuracy, because I don't think any gun this small, made for concealment, is designed for tight groups. If I can hit a head and/or chest size target at 7yds, that is good enough for me for this type of gun. If I take my time, I can usually get groups the size of an index card or better. The main factors for my decision on getting the 3AT included price, concealability, and power. At the time of my purchase, the 3AT was the best blend of these, combined with reliablility (after a little work)



Did you guys notice the little tac rail on the pf-9?

Good comment about the pointlessness about worrying over the appearances of a concealed pistol?

I saw the tac rail. Just barely enough room, eh?