Which S&W models are Sigma's ?

[TMan]

I was looking at the possibility of getting a S&W pistol, but I've heard a lot about the poor quality of the Sigma models.

Looking at the S&W web-site, I see a lot of semi-automatic models, but I don't see the mention of which ones are Sigmas.

Specifically, I'm looking at the CS9 because its compact size and DAO operation. Obviously, I'm not looking at this to be a target gun. I want something with reliability.

["DoubleAction"]

TMan; This is the Sigma lineup of those I've found:

Models SW9C, SW9E, SW9F, SW9G, SW9M, SW9P, SW9V, SW9VB, SW9VE, SW40C, SW40E, SW40F, SW40G, SW40P, SW40V, SW40VE, Model 357V, and the SW380

["DoubleAction"]

TMan; The CS9, or the Chief's Special in 9mm Autoloader, has the alloy frame rather than the polymer frame of the Sigma Series. A friend on mine bought one of these pistols and raved how easy it was to conceal and carry.

[TMan]

Thanks DA, I totally missed the fact that the Sigma had a polymer frame. Looking at their web-site, they still sell the SW9VE and SW9VGE.

They are inexpensive (cheap?) with a MSRP of $419. That is interesting. Once you go to the particular model, then they say that it is a Sigma pistol.

I have the Gun Digest Book of Smith&Wesson ISBN 0-87349-792-9. I couldn't find any mention of the Sigma - I'm not saying it isn't there.

I was watching TV and this policeman, that was an instructor, really praised the CS9/CS45. He said it was the only semi-auto that he would carry in a belly-band. He pointed out two revolvers too, which were the small hidden-hammer DAO models by S&W.

I'm working on next years budget already, and I want some idea of what I want to get from a gun standpoint. This years budget (not the gun budget) got totally blown by gardening and I barely have enough to pay the property taxes. We have to determine what percentage of my wife's salary to defer by the end of December. Once we set that, we can't change it until the following December - IRS rules!!!

In a belly-band, an accidental discharge... He didn't give reasons for his choice, but it could have been for several reasons.

["DoubleAction"]

TMan; A good hardback volume to get on the S&W is " The Standard Catalog Of Smith & Wesson" by Jim Supica and Richard Nahas. This book also has alot of information on prices and references of people like Roy Jinx, the S&W Historian. I don't totally rely on price guides found in any books or catalogs; I think we all know why.

I would think that the trigger, on any pistol you choose, for whatever purpose, will play a big part on how you will personally rate it. With the Chief's Special being a 9mm, for a pistol of it's size, I think the caliber is ideal for concealed & carry. I am tempted on this pistol myself but having not fired one yet, or handled one, I can resist the temptation a little longer.

The one thing which draws me away from some smaller pistols is the comparison to the Sigarms P-239, that I carry. The P-239 handles the .40 S&W and 357 sig cartridges like a Commander would handle a magazine of hot .45 acp hollow points.

I would want the same level of confidence in any pistol, irregardless of size, weight, caliber, or purpose. I could live with a 9mm, if it gave me a significant edge in size and weight over that of the P-239. I would still like to have a smooth trigger.

Right now it makes no difference to me either way until my renewal permit finds it's way to my mail box.

[TMan]

DA, this is not going to be a target pistol i.e. it isn't something I'll shoot very often. Since my original post, I found out that they make a CS45, which is essentially the same pistol as the CS9, but in a 45ACP package.

I've also thought about the Para PXT LDA Single Stack Carry, which is the same length, but 7oz heavier. It is also a little more money.

It is hammerless, (well, you know what I mean) like the CS45, but I've dry-fired one and I really like the trigger, not that it matters so much in a carry pistol. However, I will have to shoot it some in order to train the brain.

Para Ordnance is an unknown to me, whereas I have a lot of faith in S&W and their products. (Except for the Sigma of course).

On the other hand, I've heard nothing but rave reviews about the Para LDA. In fact while waiting for my wife in the beauty-shop (she is home for the weekend), I read an article in the current Gun Digest Magazine about the LDA. (They renamed Gun List magazine to Gun Digest Magazine.

I'm not sure why, but I'm becoming less comfortable carrying either the Seecamp or the NAA 22Mag. I don't trust the little Kimber in a belly band unless the chamber was empty, and I want to carry with one in the chamber. I like the fact that you have the thumb safety as well as the grip safety on the LDA.

I need to do more research.

["DoubleAction"]

TMan; The manual safety is an issue I brought up to my friend when he told me of his choice in the S&W Chief's Special. He had always favored the Sig Sauers for their lack of external manual safeties. His answer was carrying the S&W with the safety off. I could not agree or disagree, since I was not familiar with the S&W. Some people prefer them, some do not. Same holds true for internal or external hammers and striker fired.

I've also heard good things about the trigger on the LDA.

The market place for Compacts has grown over the past few years, which has also brought about the reduced size version of many popular full size models. This is how I adopted the Colt Officer ACP and the Sig Sauer P239, after having their full size counterparts.

[TBT]

The Sigmas are excellent guns. I'm not sure where the bad name came from (maybe a bad run right when they came out) but these are really nice guns. I implore anyone to just take the time to hold one. The way the gun sets in your hand is a work of art. They really did their homework on the design.

As fas as everything else, the fit and finish are better than the price tag and my buddy's SW9VE has been absolutely reliable. Reasonably accurate too. Worth the money IMHO.

The CS9/45 looks interesting to me but I've never even so much as held one.

[TMan]

TBT, thanks for the good words about the Sigma's. Since they are obviously the father of the M&P, which I own, I'm glad to hear that they aren't all that bad.

I think I'll budget for the Para, and if I decide against it, I can always get the CS-45.

[MLB]

I believe Xavier had a review of one of the Para's in here.

[TBT]

Fobos has hada few Paras. His last one was a bad experiment though and I believe he had to sell it off after failing to get in touch with the company for some time over some poor workmanship.

[TMan]

Whoops, that kind of sours me on them. Guess it is back to S&W, and not the Sigma. I just have to decide whether I want the CS-9 or CS-45, I'm leaning more toward the 9mm.

I've had good results with all my S&W's with the exception of one that I bought used that had this tiny little burr that you could barely see with the naked eye. It would shoot fine with 38 Specials, but would lock up with 357 Magnums. Once I found the problem, it was easy enough to fix.

[TBT]

Don't take my word for it Tman. Fobos could tell you what the deal was with that. I was just trying to remember, more talking to myself than you. I talk to myself too much though. This isn't the first time. Para gets good reviews a lot of the time.

[TMan]

TBT, I was getting cold feet anyhow. Don't worry about talking to yourself - it is when you start answering you self, and it leads to a fight. ;D

[TBT]

I'm waiting for an answer. Seems like I ignore me a lot though.

[Adam Dieffenbach]

the cheap ones that try to be a glock are the sigmas. my first gun ever was a SW9VE. quality is usually commensurate with price. this was not an exception.