Glock Connectors ???

[TMan]

OK guys, I know I'm stupid. At least I'm not one of those stupid people that think that they are smart.

I took the Ruger SR9 apart and was very much reminded of the internals of the Glock. That begged the question: how does the different weight connectors of the Glock work? They have 3lb, 5lb, and 8lb connectors. They also have some 11lb pound ones for NY police officers that have springs and I can sort of understand that.

I can understand that changing springs can change the weight of trigger pull, and I can understand how changing the angle of a sear/hammer engagement can effect trigger pull. What I don't understand is these connectors. Apparently at the end of the connector it is at a different angle, but what does that do?

The trigger bar contacts the striker and pulls it back. So a weaker striker spring would give a lighter trigger pull.

It appears to me that the Glock is half-cocked and when you pull the trigger it pulls the striker backwards and then releases it. I'm thinking if I polish the end of the striker and the trigger bar then it shoud improve the trigger pulll. (The trigger pull on the SR9 is awful).

So, how do these connectors effect the trigger weight in a Glock?

[Callahan]

Sound of crickets.

["DoubleAction"]

TMan; From what I've read, these weight reducing trigger connects reduces the length of the trigger pull, friction, improves the reset, and eliminates the over travel.

[TMan]

Thanks DA, that just adds more to the mystery. How does it do all that?

Now the Ghost Rocket Connector that I have in my Glock does eliminate overtravel, but it does that via an extra tab at the back of the connector. It comes with too much material and you have to file it to get the gun to fire.

I have the "Complete Glock Reference", but it doesn't explain how the different connectors really work. I don't really understand the pre-cocking part of it either. 1911's are so easy to understand, at least when functioning properly.

["DoubleAction"]

Tman; The Ghost Rocket Connector is the one I read about. Looking at Glock for an answer is like asking Colt about modifying the 1911. I would put the Ghost Connector beside the Glock connector and compare the dimensions of the two.

I don't own a Glock because as you well know by now, it would burden me with having to acquire more leather, holsters, and magazines, but I wouldn't be bothered with having to purchase grips for the pistol. If I had a Glock, I would be more helpful to you. I do have a police training video on the Glock, which shows the internal actions of the pistol; I might look at it.

[TMan]

DA, when I installed the Ghost Rocket Connector, it was clear that there was this extra tab on it that I had to file away some of the metal in order to get the gun functional again.

I just did a Google on "glock connector comparisons" and got several hits. One of them is from organization called thehighroad and they showed the following picture:



So the angle is different. The ones I have all have the same angle i.e. they are the 3.5lb connectors.

I have the field-stripped Glock here. It is real obvious how the extra tab stops the trigger bar to eliminate over-travel. I'm trying to figure out the angle thing. There is a "bird's head" on the end of the trigger bar that makes contact with the connector. Apparently the angle on the connector causes the bird's head to move the trigger bar down away from the striker. So, it looks to me that it would release the striker quicker than it would with less of an angle.

However, if that is true, it means that with a 3.5" connector you wouldn't pull the striker back as far and would get less of a hit on the primer. It does make sense that the futher back you pull the striker the more effort it would take.

Looking at the inside of the Kahr it looks like a long pull to bring back the striker prior to releasing it. There isn't any type of contact like there is with the bird's head striking the connector. I'd bet that if you had the 5 or 8 lb connector and you pulled very gently, you could feel it when the bird's head hits the connector.

It looks like the pre-cocking is just to get the trigger bar in front of the striker and reset the trigger.

If my understanding is correct, I'm kind of screwed with the SR-9 because there is no way that I can change the angle on their connector. The other thing is that with this type of design it means if there is any roughness inside the slide when you pull back the striker, you are going to feel it in the trigger. With my SR-9 you can really feel the grit as you pull back on the striker. I don't know of any way to smooth that out other than just shooting thousands of rounds through it. I'm not willing to do that.

Contrast that with the Kahr and it is just as smooth as can be when you pull back on the striker. Just comparing the machining on the two pistols tells you a lot. Oh, just thought of something: the Kahr cost twice as much - go figure.

Another thing with the Ruger is that without the slide as I move the trigger bar back and forth I can feel the bar rubbing against the frame.

I love the expression on people's faces when they dry-fire my Glock. With a little help from my friends on this forum, I now get that response with the XD too. I want that on the SR-9 - I'm spoiled.

["DoubleAction"]

TMan; That gritty contact between metal surfaces can throw the feel of a trigger to pure crap. I had the same feeling with my Sigarms P-226 when I first acquired it. I bought a reduced mainspring, polished the trigger and trigger bar, but I was still getting grit. I finally found where the trigger bar was rising into a recess on the inside of the slide. I polished the recess and the pistol now has the best trigger of all my Sig Sauers.

[TMan]

DA, that is a good point and reminds me that I need to check movement on the firing-pin blocker (called "Striker Blocker" by Ruger on this pistol).

I polished the trigger bar last night and found it a little tricky getting the trigger bar back into the fire-control housing.

I'm thinking of seeing if I can find a bore cleaning mop of suitable size that will fit into the slide where the striker goes. Then I could coat it with J-B bore cleaner cut off the end of a cleaning rod (cheap one), put it in the Dremel and polish the inside of the slide where the striker lives. I think I'd also need to polish the inside of the striker where the spring rubs against it.

I suppose if you just had one gun, and it had a gritty trigger, you could adjust to it. However, if you are shooting guns with good triggers and then get something that isn't so good then... Well, that has been my experience anyhow.

It may have to wait until after the first of the year - wife's projects for me have higher priority.

[TMan]

Well, I finished the polishing, and put everything back together.

Since I didn't have a bore mop of the right diameter, I just used a small jag and patch.

The results are:

1) I don't have a gritty feeling anymore.
2) I'm still not too happy.

I didn't catch on right away, but it finally dawned on me what was happening. As I pull the trigger I suddenly feel more resistance and then finally it breaks. So it feels like a 2-stage trigger. What I think I'm feeling is when the trigger bar hits the connector. With all the modifications to the Glock, I can't feel that, but I can with the Ruger.

As you pull the trigger on the Ruger, you see the striker moving toward you at the end of the slide. It moves quite a bit. I could reform the end of the trigger bar where it contacts the tab on the striker. That would cause it to release the striker earlier, but could also cause the gun to be dangerous.

You can polish the parts inside one of these things like you can on a Glock, but until you can change the geometry like you can with aftermarket parts...

[TMan]

I think my eyes are turning brown. I'm so full of crap. I did some playing around with, and analyzing, the SR-9 while watching the Cowboys'/Panthers' game.

I've been critical of Terrell Owens: we pay him all that money and it is all these other receivers that are getting the ball. Then TO was out because of an ankle injury. You would think all these other receivers had an injury too. Then it dawned on me: the defense had been occupied covering TO, and without him there the defense was free to roam. So even thought TO is not getting balls thrown to him, he is a major factor in the Cowboys' winning games.

I was also full of it about the way the SR-9 works: looking at where the trigger bar is located when the trigger is forward, and comparing the position of the trigger bar to the slide showed that the striker has to be very much cocked and when you pull the trigger, there isn't all that much movement of the striker.

Also, when the gun is cocked, the trigger bar has already made contact with the connector. What I'm feeling when I pull the trigger is the trigger bar is moving backward and the connector is pushing the trigger bar toward the right side of the frame. I can slip a piece of paper between the trigger bar and the frame when the gun is cocked. After the trigger has been pulled, the paper is captured between the frame and the trigger bar. Something is going on inside the "fire control housing" that is giving me this feeling of a 2-stage trigger. I'm not sure where this binding is coming from but I think it is between the trigger bar and the frame.

to be continued...

[TMan]

There is a tab on the bottom of the connector that holds the connector into the housing. It isn't at a 90⁰ angle. Consequently, the top of the connector is away from the housing.

As I mentioned above, the trigger bar is moving to the right of the gun as the trigger is pulled and it rubs agains the frame. So I took a stone, probably not the greatest choice of tools - in retrospect fine sandpaper would have been better, and smoothed out a couple of rough spots on the side of the frame.

I then decreased the angle of the connector tab. It took a couple of tries but I got it so there is just a little bit of space between the connector and the safety.

The results: got rid of the two stage feeling. The take-up is still quite long, and because of the heavy spring, it is fairly heavy, but then I'm getting a clean break, which is what my objective was in the first place. So, no more gritty feeling and the trigger is decent for a striker-fired pistol, but no where near the current state of my Glock nor my XD.

[MLB]

Too bad there isn't likely to be a big demand for pistolsmiths in China. It would make a good side career for you TMan.

[TMan]

Actually, it wouldn't be a career for me anywhere because I refuse to work on anyone else's guns. The only exception I ever made was at the range one day:

One of the members brought a guest who had a S&W semi that would go click, but not bang. Neither he nor I had any gun oil, but he had a can of Sheath in his bag. I had him field-strip it, but then I sprayed the Sheath into the firing pin area with the instructions that when he gets home he needs to throughly clean and oil it. Bang, bang, bang.

He seemed like a very nice guy, and I hated to see him waste his $7 guest fee, which is why I made an exception. Why don't I work on other people's guns: 1) I don't have a FFL, 2) There are these leeches in society that want to rob from anyone in order to feather their own nest. They contribute nothing to the GDP, and one fair-haired, contemptible member ones to be president - several have been president in the past. I can see it going down now:

"Members of the jury, my client's husband had a pistol in his home for the protection of his family. When his home was broken into, he tried to defend his family by producing his pistol, which went click, click, click instead of bang, bang, bang. The reason this happened is because of the negligence of this Range Officer, the defendant, who sprayed a preservative on the weapon to get it to work at the range instead of having her late husband take it to a gunsmith who would have fixed it properly. Consequently, my client's husband was shot and killed by the burglar, which would not have happened had the Range Officer done the right thing and had the gun sent to a gunsmith. Therefore, we are asking for $200 million in damages (of which I get 1/3 hee,hee, hee) from this Range Officer."

[MLB]

I can see that, but it's true in all professions. If we let predetory legislation stop us from our work, no one would get anything done. That's why we pay a regular ransom, ahem, I mean insurance as a protection.